Do You Think That Bella Swan Is Toxic (Poisonus) to Jacob Black ? A question Posed by Professor Housel

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mz Twilight Obsessed on April 3, 2010 at 9:39am

You're welcome.

Permalink Reply by Doc B MD on April 4, 2010 at 1:13am

Dear Mrs. T,
An excellent point. Jacob did avoid Bella's calls to protect her. Alice Q: "Bella Werewolfs!!!.. I'll be back after you let your dog out! http://www.thetwilightsaga.com/forum/topics/do-you-think-that-bella...

Permalink Reply by Doc B MD on April 4, 2010 at 12:55am

Dear Kimmie, Please forgive the old professor in me (I don't want to sound paternal) but I have to compliment you on such as well written and insightful response. But your thoughts are almost exactly in keeping with Doctor Housel's (Professor of Writing and Literature) . In her recent essay "The Tao of Jacob Black." (like you instinctively inferred when you read the story, I didn't) Housel says that the 4300 year old symbol Tao. (Of the merging white and black teardrops.) Jacob, as you two both observed, would be the yang (or black drop) which represents softness and warmth, Edward would be the white (Yin drop) for hard and cold. And as she said, and you imply, they flow into each other. But here is your and her genius, you both see that Bella is the white dot on Jacob black tear, and the black dot in Edward's white Yin. THAT IT IS SHE THAT HOLDS THEM TOGETHER!! WELL DONE KIM!!

Dr Houser said "They are good for Bella, and she is good for them. Bella creates peace between them. Which sound almost identical to your " My point is, they compliment each other, both are good for Bella in their different ways and Bella is good for both of them, to create peace amongst lasting enemies over generations. (Kimmy! You really aren't Dr Houser pulling my leg are you?)
Your point that Bella went to Jacob, and that she admited to him about her damaged soul, are also important points. And your observation that the story led to the "inevitable" union of Jacob and Nesse is also very insightful. I was just re-reading Aristotle's lecture on nature of dramatic stories and plays. (330 BC) He said: "The conclusion of all written dramas (ie; Nesse and Jacob's union) is already fixed before the author ever sets stylus to wax (pen to paper) all that matters is how he ( there were no female authors at that time) takes us there!
Stephanie Meyers said. Almost as soon as I had started writing Edward and Bella's story, the very NEXT character I envisioned was NESSE!. (Somewhere Aristotle is Smiling)

You conclude "Which in turn moves on to include Renesmee. That's not so bad." No Kimmy like your response, as a mater of fact, it is very good. Very good indeed. Thank you for sharing with us, Doc

Permalink Reply by KimmieCullen - Black on April 4, 2010 at 4:14pm

Doc,
Thanks so much for your comments. They've flattered me enormously. Sometimes i get carried away with my views because it's a topic i'm so passionate about. You know so much about so much that i feel like my views pale into insignificance haha! It's so lovely to get such compliments. Thank you.

Permalink Reply by The Cullens and Jacob on April 5, 2010 at 12:18pm

Alice: do I think Bella's toxic to Jacob well my answer would be no i think Bella wasnt flirting with Jacob just being a good friend to him. Jacob probably thought that she was flirting with him witch made him more attracted to her. Of course Bella love's Jacob but in a friendly way and during the books their friendship grew into love but Bella's heart was already taken by Edward. Jacob didnt want to let go of Bella so he kept close to her until she had Renesmee. That's when things changed for Jacob he imprinted on Renesmee.

Permalink Reply by ShannonP on April 7, 2010 at 1:43am

Counterpoint answers:
D. Could Bella have kept Jacob around to subconsciously punish Edward for hurting her?
I might think so except that Bella didn't even really consider that Edward might be jealous until Angela pointed it out to her, and by that time she'd already gone to see Jake and had forced the issue with Edward to some extent. So I think if anything, it's more that Jacob has become a sort of security blanket for her. She loves Edward, and she's starting to understand why he felt that he had to leave her, but she hasn't entirely regained her trust in him despite her epiphany that he really does love her. So I think that she might keep Jacob around for his friendship and the sense of comfort she gets from him, and perhaps a tiny part of it is that Edward has to keep proving to her over and over that he really does love her by being so accepting of Jake's presence in her life. But I don't think it was to punish him, more that she needed proof of his love in order to regain the trust.
E. (This is not about Bella but:) if a girl is dumped by a guy, do you think it is ok for her to use another boy to comfort her. One who obviously loves her, but who she knows she can never have deep feelings for ? No, I don't think it's okay. I think it's a selfish thing to do, even if the girl is honest with the guy. Because the girl knows that the guy is secretly (or not so secretly) hoping for more, and she knows very well that she will never be able to return his feelings. Even if he says he's fine with that, he's not. He's still hoping, and false hope is just not fair.
D. It seemed to me that Jacob was "hooked on the beach" and became enamored with Bella because of her flirtatious actions. At a time when she had no real interest in him. Do you feel that way? Yes, to some extent I do. She did deliberately lead him on. He may have been interested anyway, since he'd known her when they were kids, but there is never any discussion that indicates Jake was interested in her before they met again at La Push, when Bella flirted with him.
E. Did Bella's spirit of love change Jacob just as it had Edward? I think it changed him, but not quite in the same way it changed Edward.
1. Robert Pattinson has told the press that he and Kristin Stewart are a couple. With public relations being what they are, do you feel that they really are a couple?
I don't have an opinion if they are or aren't together. I only hope they are both happy, whatever the status of their personal lives may be. However, if what you're referring to is the article that appeared in The Sun after the BAFTA party claiming that Rob admitted that he was with Kristen, the reporter involved has admitted that he took Rob's comments out of context and had never even asked Rob if he and Kristen were a couple. So to date, there has still been no true statement to the press from either of them other than that they are friends.
2. Were in the books is the story about Marcus, and the fact that Aro killed his sister/love? Where is it? ANd what was said? This is background on SMeyer's website.
3. In Breaking dawn after Bella offers her life for Edward, Aro makes a statement in Latin. What did his soliloquy mean in English ? I'm not positive, but I've read elsewhere that it means "Nor yours." Then, referring to Bella and Edward, "One can't live without the other" (roughly, but not exact.) But this could be wrong, so don't quote me on it.
4. What does Jacob say to Bella in Quileute? Stay with me always.
5. In New Moon at Bella's b-day party she cut her finger and Jasper went crazy: Why would they have another party (graduation) at the house with humans, because at anytime any one could cut themselves and Jasper would go crazy again? Why would they risk that in front of the whole school? I think it was a calculated risk. Jasper was fairly distracted with events in Forks and Seattle; his mind was focused elsewhere, on figuring things out in order to protect his family and Bella. He didn't attack Bella in the ballet studio for the same reasons, in my opinion--he was focused on other things. Also, I think Jasper just felt so awful after what happened at Bella's party that he was more able to control himself after that. So I don't think there was much risk involved with the party.

Permalink Reply by Margarida Marques on April 7, 2010 at 11:46am

As an answer to all the questions made, these are my points of view:

1. Bella wasn't toxic to Jacob, because he was her best friend. They got on well with each other, he was her brother, "her best man" as she says. If he fell for her, it wasn't her fault, She was always clear about her feeling for him, and even though he considered himself as an option for her, she never did.

D. Bella never kept Jacob around to punish Edward for hurting her. She kept Jacob around, because she considered him her brother, as I said before. She didn't care that Edward didn't want her around Jacob at the beginning, so friendship was the only motive she had to keep Jacob around.

E. I don't think it is OK to use another boy to comfort, even though we hear many times that one big love is only forgotten, when another one arrives. If a girl is dumpted by a guy, she should get comfort around her friends, around the people who care for her. It's the natural thing to do. It's a way of survival. That is what happened to Bella in New Moon - she seeked a friend, the only one she trusted - Jacob.

D. I think Bella wasn't flirting with him . She was always being a friend - only a good friend, even though there was a beach as a scenario. Bella always treated him like a brother.

E. Bella's spirit of love only functioned with Edward, because he is a gentleman, who besides living for her, knows exactly what love means (to sacrifice ourselves and our feelings for the one we love). In what concerns Jacob, he would only be changed by a spirit of love when he imprinted, then his whole life would revolve only around Renesmee.

1. Maybe they are together or not. It doesn't concern me. It doesn't affect me anyway.

2. Don't remember.

3. I couldn't find the statement but if you tell me, I can translate it for you.

4. Quilluette is not a language or a place. It is an Indians race of people. So I can't understand your question here.

5. They would risk doing the graduation party, because it was a way for Bella to say goodbye to her human friends. It was considered by the Cullen family an important human event Bella couldn't miss while she was still human.

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